Fireside with Jared McCarthy: Reimagining Media in a World That Craves Connection
In the latest Fireside episode on the Responsibly Different™ podcast, we sat down with Jared McCarthy, co-founder of the Venue Ad Network (VAN), to explore a bold question: What if media showed up in moments that actually matter?
Jared’s journey through the media world is deep—15+ years in New York City, including iconic work on HBO's Game of Thrones era. But it was a return to Maine during the pandemic that sparked something new. When a casual conversation with a friend and fellow media veteran turned into an idea—one that now powers VAN—Jared realized something was missing in modern advertising: real connection.
A Stage for Something Better
VAN is transforming independent music venues into a curated, values-aligned media network. Think of the screens you already see at venues like the State Theatre in Portland, the Troubadour in LA, or First Ave in Minneapolis—not bombarded by ads, but thoughtfully integrating 15-second placements during the quiet moments before the show starts.
It's not about pushing products. It's about showing up with purpose, when people are present, together, and fully alive in an experience.
Jared puts it best:
“You’re standing around with your friends, waiting for the headliner, and no one’s really looking at their phones. That’s the moment brands can show up—not interrupting, but enhancing.”
The Shift from Performance to Presence
Today’s media landscape is obsessed with performance: clicks, impressions, conversions. But VAN is part of a growing movement that values resonance just as much. It’s about reaching real people in real places—not just pixels.
This is especially important for Gen Z and younger millennials, who are showing up in person less for traditional ads and more for community, culture, and experience. And these indie venues? They’re more than entertainment—they’re cultural infrastructure.
That’s why VAN gives 60% of ad revenue directly back to the venues, supporting the arts ecosystem while inviting brands to be part of something bigger.
From Rideshares to Retro Warnings: Ads That Actually Help
Whether it’s a rideshare discount that helps concertgoers get home safely or a Department of Transportation campaign using retro 8-bit graphics to discourage drunk driving, VAN's approach is refreshingly human. It's media that adds value, not noise.
So, What’s the Bigger Story?
We believe that media can—and should—be a force for good. That means breaking free from the programmatic conveyor belt and choosing to show up in places where connection still thrives.
Venue Ad Network isn’t just helping brands innovate. It’s helping local venues survive. It’s fostering community in an age of isolation. And it’s proof that where and how we advertise matters.
If you’re in media, work with brands, or just love good music and better stories, we hope you’ll give this episode a listen.
🎧 Listen to this Responsibly Different™ episode now on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
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Chris Marine (00:01.199)
Well, thanks for being on the podcast, Jared. I super excited to have you on here. As a co-founder of VAN, I'm always interested. I know you have a deep media background, but before we get into talking about Venuad Network, which we're gonna probably refer to as VAN a lot here, give us your background. You have a deep media background. Like what was the origin story of VAN? What made you come up with this awesome idea?
Jared McCarthy (00:22.168)
Sure. First of all, thanks for having me. Excited to be here talking to you guys. Well, I was in media in New York City for about 15 years. So started off in media planning and strategy.
holdcos, which all seem to be converging into one thing now, but yeah, working across a variety of clients. I always liked it, kind of just fell into it, honestly. I went to college and was an English major. I played music. I always kind of knew advertising was a bit more of a creative, yet somewhat safe corporate career. So I felt like it would suit me well and it
Definitely did. But yeah, after about 15 years working in media, moved to Maine during the pandemic, which is where my wife and I are both from. We've got two girls, moved back here and started working at Via, which is a creative agency here in Maine. I was there for about three years and unfortunately was laid off as is again, the parlance of our time. And I loved working there. But.
Chris Marine (01:29.221)
As is the industry. Yep.
Jared McCarthy (01:36.456)
Shortly after that, connected with, reconnected with an old friend and colleague who I worked with at PhD, which was an agency in New York. We worked together on HBO and we worked together on HBO during its heyday with Game of Thrones. Like I worked on seasons one through three maybe, and then I left for a while and then I came back and I worked on the final seasons. So really like that was when HBO was...
top of the heap and there was really no competition. So it was kind of glory days. But anyway, reconnected with my friend Brian Donahoe, who had had a similar recent event of being laid off from Google after 10 years of working sales there. He and I started talking and he told me about having recently been at a show in Chicago.
and he and his wife were standing around between sets, between the opening act and the headliner. And he was just thinking like, well, it's kind of unbelievable that there's no ad presence of any kind during this moment, especially in a world where advertising is everywhere, whether we like it or not. It is everywhere, it does serve a purpose. And...
This is a rare opportunity where you have a captive audience of potentially thousands and thousands of people, depending on the venue, who could be seeing something together. And it's an opportunity for like, you know, kind of a water cooler moment for a brand to really speak to someone. And yet there was no one, no one there. So he called me up with this idea, knowing that obviously we work together, we've got this media background. I'm also a musician. I've played a lot of these independent venues around the country.
and we started talking about it and, know, I was like, that's an awesome idea. Kind of so much so that you're like, it's so obvious and seems like surely someone has tried this and failed or there's a reason this doesn't work or you run into issues with labels and management and the bands get involved and it's just so complicated. Yeah. And
Chris Marine (03:58.553)
Lots of variables.
Jared McCarthy (04:01.676)
You know, we were talking specifically about independent venues because we don't want to go up against or somehow, I don't think we could integrate ourselves into a live nation, you know, structure. know, live nation already has this network of venues that can do this. That, you know,
Jared McCarthy (04:31.47)
Live Nation.
Chris Marine (04:36.677)
There's a lot of things with Live Nation. But that must be where the passion comes from, because you do have this opportunity. That's one thing that's always drawn me and kept me on the media side of this business is that you have an opportunity to monetize a space too that I'd imagine supports the independent venues in a really strong, powerful way.
Jared McCarthy (04:36.75)
Let me just read. Yeah, exactly, exactly.
Jared McCarthy (04:52.672)
Yeah, exactly. you know, Live Nation serves a purpose, but Live Nation, at least in this story, is a bit of the foil to what we're doing. You know, we all know Live Nation owns and operates a lot of venues. They're promoters of many bands. Bands have exclusive contracts with Live Nation. They, of course, own Ticketmaster. So they've got this whole vertical integration that
is sort of a necessary, or at least right now, there's really no way to avoid them if you're a concert goer. And I don't want to speak ill of them, but the venues that I really love and that Brian, my partner, really love are independent venues. from Portland, or I'm from Falmouth, Maine, right next to Portland, where there's the State Theater, which I actually just recently went and saw a show there.
It was Sunny Day Real Estate. It's a band from the 90s that I grew up. It's sort of an early emo indie band and they were incredible, incredible. And I love, they have four albums. I know them all like front to back. So it was me and a bunch of other, you know, zennials standing around singing songs. A lot of dudes just.
Chris Marine (05:52.325)
What was the show?
Jared McCarthy (06:20.92)
solo without their wives. That was me. Yes. I didn't subject my wife to this. I was like, you're you might like it, but you know, I'll just go by myself. This is it's like a special thing that may not, you know, be loved by all. But for people that grew up on it, it's really meaningful. But the state theater itself is really meaningful. It's got a ton of character. It's got a ton of history. It's a like institution.
Chris Marine (06:23.333)
Was that you, Jared?
Jared McCarthy (06:50.126)
here in Maine, here in Portland, certainly. And these are the venues that I love. And there's a million of these venues all around the country. And the thing that really kind of where this idea developed after Brian initially approached me about it, where we kind of landed with it, long story short, is like, all right, one venue by itself is great, but you're not gonna get a national brand on board.
with one thousand cap venue in Chicago. But what if we built a network? What if we were sort of the facilitators of a bunch of these independent venues around the country that then we could work with brands to then distribute the ads across all of these venues under one banner as like one buy?
And that's kind of how Vanu Add Network, which in its name is, it's right there. But we also.
Chris Marine (07:51.941)
Can you break that down, like take us through for folks that maybe it's been a hot second since they've been in one of these venues. Where are these brands appearing? What is that environment that you're creating there for the brand?
Jared McCarthy (08:00.59)
Sure. Sure. So we're working with venues right now that have existing screens. So on its most base, basic level, we are leveraging the screens that already exist inside these venues. there are often screens. Let's see, let's think. So the Salt Shed, for example, is a relatively new, huge 5,000 capacity venue in Chicago. It's like,
It's kind of considered one of the best new venues in the country. It's the old Morton Salt hanger that they've converted into this incredible venue and they get huge A-list acts. You know, think Gracie Abrams just played there, know, My Morning Jacket, Wilco, all those guys are playing there this summer.
They have a lot of the more modern venues are outfitted with a lot of screens. So like when you walk into the salt shed, for example, there is a big screen in the entryway. There are screens in the balconies. And then most like impactfully, there are two massive IMAG screens on either side of the stage. There's an outdoor part to it. So it sort of looks like this big festival stage with two huge screens on each side. And that's where we're showing up.
Because what they're putting in on those screens is house content promoting upcoming shows Occasionally like trivia and then we're just integrating ads 15-second static ads right now It's gonna evolve some can take video. But right now we're just keeping it pretty You know streamlined You're just integrating and just essentially just have a 15-second static ad that appears in the house content that is running
between sets, before sets. So during the actual show, the ads are off because that's when that house content is off.
Chris Marine (09:59.653)
So I think what's interesting about it is it seems like our industry is finally coming to a reckoning with this obsession with performance-based media. Why do you think that place-based media is, and maybe I just, that's a leading question a little bit, but why do you think that there's place-based media is really coming to be more sought after now?
Jared McCarthy (10:22.346)
Yeah, it's funny. It's like, so I guess taking a step back, like when we are pitching brands on this idea, which we've gotten great feedback, we're about a year old. So we're still brand new, but growing fast. We've got about 80 venues right now. It's funny. We talked to out at home teams and they're like, wow, this isn't really place based. But then other teams consider like we're somewhere in the
out of home sponsorship, because yes, the screens are like the bread and butter, but we also just give brands access to these venues where it's their sponsorship components. There's access to their own email newsletters, their socials, their SMS capabilities. But all that to say, coming back more specifically to your question, you know, I think we've gone really heavy in that.
serves a purpose, of course, but really heavy into the programmatic and social worlds. And it's sort of ironic that you say social when it's actually kind of anti-social, the actual media itself, because you're seeing it alone. after all the, one of the things that Brian and I talked about early on that we would laugh about is like, after all of the discussions, all of the philosophizing and the panels and the
think pieces about media and about advertising. At the end of the day, it ends up being like a little banner ad you see on your phone while you're sitting on the toilet. And the thing with place-based is like, you know, just to use that term broadly, it's like...
I don't think enough discussion is being had around where you're actually seeing and experiencing the ad and what the mood is that you're in and what the feeling that your brand could be associated with. Again, out of home, like frequency transit out of home absolutely serves a purpose. I'm thinking of when I lived in New York, it's...
Jared McCarthy (12:35.848)
see ads on the subway and you're just kind of heads down on your phone, you're stressed out, you're moving. You certainly can see the message, but you're not in a mindset to be super receptive necessarily, at least I wasn't always. Whereas in a venue, you're having like a special experience. It could be the best moment of your week, month, year, and.
David Gogel (12:43.104)
Yeah.
Jared McCarthy (13:03.552)
a brand has an opportunity to come in and put themselves alongside that mom and speak to this person in a way that's a, you know, understanding and hopefully additive to the experience.
David Gogel (13:20.499)
Yeah, we we often I mean, to your point, our hearing clients talk about resonance and relevance in the contextual moment more and more beyond kind of just talking about the region. So I think I think you're right on there. Jared, I'm also I'm also curious, you know, when we talk about some of these venues, right? Your your mind immediately jumps to some of the larger venues or even some of those well known venues. But it's interesting, right? One of the big
challenges that these venues have.
is, especially in some of the more rural parts of the country, like there's not a music venue ecosystem, right? There's usually like one big place where you have to be at a certain level to perform. And when we look at this and, you know, folks who listen to this podcast a lot, I've talked about some of the experience that I have outside of the working day on around economic development. you know, Jared, we've talked offline about some of this, right? But the importance of music venues in a community to foster
Jared McCarthy (13:59.0)
Mm-hmm.
David Gogel (14:23.196)
you know, art and culture and that when we think about whether or not you're talking about Iron Horse in Northampton, you know what I mean? We talked about some of these big, big spaces. It's hard to build a feeder system and one of the reasons why that is is because the pro forma on a music venue is hard to get sign off on, right? It's hard to make the math work. And so I'm really interested as you guys are talking about this, do you see an opportunity to have this advertising revenue truly be a
like a big driver in the ability for people to create new music venues that seem economically feasible to create more of a kind of an ecosystem in some of these communities. Long-winded way of getting at it, but what are your thoughts there?
Jared McCarthy (15:03.982)
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think the long-term vision is to create a sort of new way that independent venues can confidently thrive and be created without fear of getting kind of squashed by Live Nation. Not even Live Nation aside, it's like...
Venues aren't making the money they once were. People aren't drinking as much alcohol. Certainly Gen Z's intake is a lot lower than my generation's. insurance costs through the roof, everything is obviously a lot more expensive. So it is not a super high margin business if you're a venue owner. What we offer is...
at least 60 % of our ad revenue goes directly to these venues. So we, yeah. So we want to set them up for success and we want to again, make the ads additive. want to make them relevant for people we. But we are reaching out to and having great discussions with a lot of brands that really make sense for this audience. We do not want to become like an eyesore. We do not want to ruin the character of these places.
David Gogel (16:02.378)
amazing because that yeah like God
Jared McCarthy (16:25.432)
We don't want to just plaster ads everywhere. want to be tasteful. We want to be respectful. But we think that this, you know, again, long-term, like we want this to become kind of the standard thing that people expect to see in these venues and they understand why they're there. And again, there's maybe even utilitarian aspects to it. Like we're looking at some ride share partners. We got a test coming up actually with one right now. And it's like,
David Gogel (16:43.688)
Right.
Jared McCarthy (16:55.978)
offering a discount code or a percentage off on the ride home, telling them exactly when the show ends and when to book that ride home. Like that's an additive nice bonus and hopefully creates a new concert going behavior.
David Gogel (17:11.666)
Yeah, I think that's right on the nose because we often see that there's this huge gap between musicians that can play in a bar or a restaurant and then a huge gap towards you're able to play a venue like state theater, right?
Jared McCarthy (17:25.996)
Right. Right.
David Gogel (17:30.428)
having a resource to make it more viable, to have that missing middle within the music kind of performance venue space is really, really helpful. I think for Chris and I, often dialogue about, looking for more, we really love like cinema, for instance. We leverage cinema more than like, I think a lot of other agencies because of those powerful like lean back moments. And so it's interesting to see how this is gonna fit into plans where folks have been
Jared McCarthy (17:47.758)
Mm-hmm.
David Gogel (18:00.391)
of more limited with the tools that they have. that I think that's a yeah.
Jared McCarthy (18:02.968)
Totally, and cinema's a good, you know, it's an analogous media format in that it's, you know, a captive environment. You're getting some like-minded people in one space. I would say what separates us, then, you know, I'm slightly biased here in what makes us better than cinema. I love cinema. I'm a huge movie fan. I love going to the theater still. Is that we...
There's an opportunity for high frequency throughout the show. So the ads are gonna show up every three to four quote unquote slides within their playlist. So there's a lot of opportunity for creative messaging and sequential messaging and portfolio plays and to inspire conversation among a group that is truly sharing the same passion.
David Gogel (18:41.703)
Mm-hmm.
Jared McCarthy (18:56.186)
And there's opportunities to really create that conversation. Unlike cinema, which again, love, it's super impactful, it sound on, but it plays and then the ad is over and then you go into the movie. So there's not really a lot of conversation as a group around it versus standing around with your friends, milling around, not knowing where to look really while someone else goes off and grabs all the beers and comes back.
David Gogel (18:56.318)
Hmm.
David Gogel (19:20.029)
Yeah.
Jared McCarthy (19:24.674)
But that is not to say that cinema isn't an amazing, impactful format. It's just a slightly different tactic.
Chris Marine (19:34.501)
And there's interesting things to layer on top of anything that you're doing within the venue. You can layer on anything from like a geo fence around the location. can, people think, I think sometimes that you can, if you're investing in that area that digital is a part of the solution, it's like, no, it's just, you layer on, it's a puzzle.
Jared McCarthy (19:42.669)
Yeah.
Jared McCarthy (19:52.76)
Digital is absolutely a piece of it. It's like the screens are sort of the entry point, not mandatory as part of if you're gonna be working with us or you want access to key venues. But that's our qualifier for working with venues is if they have substantial screen space, they are all ticketed events. The majority of these are iconic, well-known venues.
like Troubadour in LA, First Ave in Minneapolis, or Prince Gust, or Tipitina's in New Orleans, elsewhere in Brooklyn, and everywhere in between. And then we got a bunch of festivals like Bomber Shoot and Kilby Block Party and Day in Day Out and Three Points and North Coast. But yeah, mean, it's, yeah.
Chris Marine (20:49.009)
What advice do you give to folks who might be more digital native that are looking to invest in bringing that experience for the brand they're repping or the brand themselves to this environment?
Jared McCarthy (21:05.132)
Yeah, I I guess to finish off where I was trailing off in the last question is that a lot of these, most of these venues and certainly the festivals all have digital components to them, whether that's, know, Geofancy capabilities, whether that's sponsorship of apps, email newsletters, things like that. I think it's just, you know, we, when we first started this, we're like,
It would be great to just be a line item on a flow chart as like, this is a cool bell and whistle to a campaign. It's not the main aspect of a campaign. I completely understand the importance of digital and that like hyper-targeting component and that performance. But I do also think that sometimes we've gone a little all in too quickly on some of it and
It's questionable when you get the results. mean, there's obviously a lot of fraud. And one of the things that we like to say with this is you could see the ad, right? I mean, that's sort of the beauty of at home. It's like, there it is. Like there's no other place it's going to show up other than these screens. And when we talk about social and digital and, you know, programmatic, it's like, you never, you're not always sure where this stuff's ending up.
And certainly you can't control when it's showing up always. So, you know, I think one of the struggles we've had certainly with more with agencies is that we're a new company. It requires some like vetting on their end. requires, you know, there's a lot of questions and we're always open and welcome to answering any and all questions. But I think sometimes, you know, sometimes it's a bigger agent.
Chris Marine (22:57.219)
Risk tolerance on the agency side is lower sometimes.
Jared McCarthy (23:00.212)
Yeah, there's, yes, it's the risk tolerance and it's also, you know, being an agency guy myself for many years, I know how this works. Sometimes it's just like, it's just easier to put the money in here because we know it kind of works and we can throw it into program. Yeah.
Chris Marine (23:13.413)
It's that conveyor belt we talk about all the time here is like a boutique firm. like, it's easier just to place it where you can click, click, click, boom.
Jared McCarthy (23:19.854)
Yeah, and I think they're greater risk, greater reward kind of thing. The brands that we are working with this summer, I'm really excited about and I really commend them for trying something new.
Chris Marine (23:41.861)
Are you able to give us a tease, understandably, if you cannot, but any teases you can give with who you're working with?
Jared McCarthy (23:45.422)
So right now, I mentioned the ride share app. Another one is actually related to driving, which it's sort of funny because it works nicely in tandem with this ride share partner. There's basically two big ones. Use your imagination. But another one that we're working with is
actually the Illinois Department of Transportation, Don't Drink and Drive campaign. So they have a really cool campaign called It's Not a Game. And it's sort of these eight bit graphics. It's cool, creative. And it's all about messaging around like, this isn't a video game. You can't crash your car and just bounce back. This is real life. And they're really like cool, retro.
Chris Marine (24:19.085)
Smart.
Jared McCarthy (24:42.36)
tongue-in-cheek, but very important messages. So we're working there with just in a Chicago only buy right there. So we can do it by markets. We can even go as granular as venues themselves, but we try to sell that. In an ideal world, we're selling this as a national package for a month like you would.
Chris Marine (25:06.691)
Yeah, bigger packet.
Jared McCarthy (25:10.51)
and a standard at home flight. But, you know, that's again, that's, that's further down the road perhaps, because that's, that's quite a risk for a brand to just be like, yeah, let's just, let's just go for the whole thing. But we think there's, there's value in that because you're really just, it's an audience play. You're hitting these people who are really, you know, it's heavy Gen Z, it's majority 75 % Gen Z, early millennial audience.
Chris Marine (25:13.189)
next time.
Chris Marine (25:24.91)
Yeah.
Jared McCarthy (25:38.926)
who are, who, you know, they're all the cool kids in every market. I mean, we've got a bunch of stuff in Montana of all places and there's, have incredible venues out there. And it's like a lot of people who are in their twenties, like moved out there post COVID. It's yeah, it's not just New York and LA, which of course are always going to be important. But I think that's another thing that kind of that we try to convince brands of is like, look at these smaller markets.
Chris Marine (25:53.423)
Digital nomads, they can go anywhere.
Jared McCarthy (26:08.48)
Oklahoma City, Minneapolis, where people are over indexing, you know, in terms of moving there in droves. Yes, you're not going to compete population wise in New York, but you're also not getting the clutter there.
Chris Marine (26:21.765)
I was gonna say, you can have a greater impact. Like we say, even with some of the national brands we work with, we're constantly saying, like, don't count out, like, really having a strong local presence. Well, on that note, as we kind of round out here, this is all super beneficial. You've been on the cutting edge of great media strategies for a while. There's a lot of things that our industry can be...
Jared McCarthy (26:29.326)
Totally, totally.
Jared McCarthy (26:42.328)
Thank you.
Chris Marine (26:46.575)
pessimistic about with the rise of AI, we're not going to go there. I want to know though, like you've seen a lot, you've worked on a lot. You're now a co-founder of your own business in the media space, which is, I can't even fully imagine a lot. What is giving you hope? And when you wake up on a beautiful day, like what we have here in Maine, summer, beautiful day, like what's inspiring you in the industry and in general in your life as a co-founder.
Jared McCarthy (27:12.174)
Hmm.
Yeah, mean, A Sunny Day here in Maine is such a novelty that I don't even know what to do with it. I'm like, it's too hot. And it's like 72. I'm like, it's actually perfect. Yeah, there's a lot that's inspiring. mean, I, you know, not to get political here, but I do think in the face of, you know, kind of an existential adversity, great things happen, I think.
Chris Marine (27:19.489)
That's enough to celebrate.
Jared McCarthy (27:44.51)
we're probably going to see some incredible innovation. And I won't even like touch on AI because it's just so like table stakes now. I'm hopeful about AI, like in about its integration into our lives in the same way that people were scared of the internet when it came out and scared of TV when that came out. Like I think there's going to be a balance that we're going to work out and it won't necessarily like, you know, cut us all out of our jobs.
But I do think with the rise of things like AI and more automation that there's going to be more emphasis on, you know, experience and emotion and like resonance and connection and real connection. I think, again, social people say, that's all about connection. You're like, not really. mean, at this point, it's just algorithmic stuff being delivered specifically to you. And what the beauty of VAN is, is that it's
you know, you're speaking to this group of people who share something and often it's like a special secret. I think there's going to be more in real life community activations and things that brands are gonna take advantage of there. Like trying to get in and these like, you know, you could say a.
a, you know, Sunny Day real estate concert in state theater where there's 1500 people. Like that's a niche little subculture of Portland, Maine, Sunny Day real estate fans. And that's a special group. That is a very specific group. I think creative can get really cool there. I, I think, I think creative is going to take some leaps and bounds. think, it's going to get more tailored.
to people in a way that, and loosen the reins a bit. I think the best messaging and everyone talks about, know, liquid death and, you know, name your brand where it's like, wow, how do they do this? It's like, just cause they just do it. Like it's because, yeah, it's not focus group. It's not focus group to death. It's just sort of instinctive and cool and risky and irreverent. And that's.
Chris Marine (29:48.537)
Yeah.
Chris Marine (29:55.173)
They're not focusing strictly on impressions and clicks. That's why. That's why. Yeah.
Jared McCarthy (30:07.914)
So our hope for this environment, these environments, these indie venues and using VAN is like, have fun. that's probably my hope for brands moving forward. It's just like, sure, you can incrementally increase conversion or whatever or engagement by fine tuning your social strategy, which of course has its place. But what if you just did something really crazy and really simple and even like,
cheap? Just take the, just take a leap, see what happens. I think there needs to be some more risk taking and it seems like a long way of answering that is I think people are going to start taking a little more creative risk taking.
Chris Marine (30:52.933)
So you're leaving us, I think, on a great place. You're leaving us with hope for creativity, hope for innovation, hope for real connection, and around really focusing on paying attention to those more niche areas. And everyone knows if you follow anything that changes in culture, it comes from smaller pockets of mobilized people. So I that's an awesome place. Dan, thanks for being here, Jared. This was great.
Jared McCarthy (31:00.387)
Yes.
Jared McCarthy (31:14.232)
Yeah.
No, thanks for having me. This is great.
